Ratings & Comments
I modified the sentnences
I think you can omit "the type and number of pieces captured in each other", as in a game without drops this must be the same if the position on the board is the same.
Ah, I fixed them. Thanks !
// Even if there are only two Kings left on the board, the King closer to the enemy camp wins in the end, as the same situation cannot be created more than three times.
// About threefold repetition :
If the same situation occurs 3 times with the number, type, and location of each other's pieces remaining on the board, the player who created the situation loses. Simply put, no player can create the same situation 3 times in one game.
- Even if it does not appear in a row, if the same state occurs 3 times in a game, threefold repetition is established.
(Of course, it is also impossible to repeat the check consecutively.)
You write the variant does not have piece drops, but then you write: " The player who can no longer move or drop pieces loses".
It is not clear what you mean by 'situation' in the description of the repetition rule. Is that just the same board position, or does it also mean the same player has to be on move? When you write the 'after it occurred twice no one can repeat the position again' you suggest that it does not matter who has the move. Because one it does, only the player that created the position for the first time could recreate it.
And about the absence of a 50-move rule: it it really your intention that when an endgame of King versus King results the players should go on until one of them gets stalemated by the ban on repetition? That seems awful.
The ascii diagram of the initial position seems redundant. And wrong too, because there is a Templar in there.
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Forget my comment about Imp, I see what it is. And I should have remembered the Furious Fiend from shogivariants.
Yes nice! I suggest to add a definition for "cardinal". Is that synonym of Orthogonal in this context? Maybe some diagrams would help understanding the moves. I have seen a typo : heaens. Why these name of Imp and Fiend? I have to check, I don t know these words in English.
I've fixed the file names, alongside a few formatting bugs and making sure pawns don't share a letter with any other piece.
While I understand why Earth got the a-h files, I would suggest giving them to the skies, while Earth gets the middle ones (j-q). This makes the files be in alphabetical order when the board is setup, and as an added nice bonus, the "missing" files i and r keep the color alternation. vg a1 white, b1 black, ..., h1 black, (i1 white), j1 black, ..., q1 white, (r1 black), s1 white, ..., y1 white, z1 black.
Nice!
It's particularly interesting how some of the 1-piece endgames (rook, angel) end up looking like a classical one to force the king out of Earth and then having the friendly king deliver the final attack. (The angel's isn't completely clear to me, since the lone king may move to the underworld early to avoid the angel's attacks, but I guess that's a significant enough detriment that then the friendly king can manage on his own.)
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After contact with Ben Reiniger - see comments below - I have adapted my description of the variant 'Chess 66'.
New is that in switches can be operated as follows: It is possible from below, from above and from the side equally to move into the switch and that independent of the direction of the move the squares of a switch can be reached separately (4 or a4 respectively 5 or h5).
It would be nice if the editors of CVP would read my description again crosswise to finally arrange for a publication. If 'Chess 66' should be published, then 'Chess 69' seems to be published as well.
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Several of the image files now appear to be missing.
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To start with point (2): This is clear that a rook on a8 cannot move to a3...a1 if a switch is occupied.
Regarding point (1), I already had doubts yesterday. According to my imagination so far, the squares of a switch (e.g. 4 and a4) can only be reached from a1...a3 or from rank 4. In my description I assume that a bishop starting from e8 can only reach square 4 of the switch and not a4. This affects a rook/queen on a8 in the same way.
But in this case it means that a move into the switch cannot be done if a piece is on a4, because then the squares 4 and a4 would be occupied together - which would not be in accordance with the rules. But this does not seem very logical.
Therefore, I think that a pragmatic solution for switches should be used.
If the switch should not be occupied, it is possible to move into the switch from above, from below or from the side, whereby either field 4 or a4 respectively 5 or h5 can be occupied.
In case the switch is occupied, the piece in the switch must be captured when the opponent's piece moves into the switch; the opponent's piece takes the place of the captured piece.
This means for your point (1): The rook on a8 can capture the piece on a4, and then it stands on a4.
This also means that a bishop on e8 can reach either square 4 or square a4. If a4 is chosen, then the next move can be towards f8 or towards d1. I think that such an procedure simplifies the rules and makes the game easier to play. What do you think?
Perhaps a remark about 'Avatar Chess'. The variants you mentioned (Lumberjack, Smess) were not known to me before. In normal chess, a piece has a fixed skill level, which means that during the game two kings, two queens, four rooks, etc. define the game. In Avatar Chess it is possible that up to 6 queens, 12 rooks etc. are in play - of course rather theoretically and then only for a short time. I think that this could be interesting.
That helps, yes. To be explicit about the "last" question in each case then, the answer is "not"? My piece on a4 (1) cannot be captured by and also (2) blocks movement (to a1...3) of an opponent rook on a8?
Thanks Ben for the questions, here it should be clearer in the description (although it is already described between the lines, but that is probably not enough).
When capturing on a switch, first assume that there can be only one piece on a switch (here I differ from Fergus Duniho's Reroute66, a variant of my idea). So, for example, if a rook or queen starts from a1...a3 or from rank 4 and the switch is not occupied, then either square 4 or square a4 can be occupied in the switch.
But there is no choice if the switch is occupied by a piece. If a rook or a queen moves from a1...a3 or from rank 4 into the switch, then the piece in the switch must be captured (because two pieces on the switch are not possible). If the piece was on square 4, then the opponent's piece is on square 4 after the move has been executed (applies to a4 in the same way).
Furthermore, an occupied switch cannot be jumped over and a direct change from 4 to a4 (vice versa a4 to 4) is not possible - differently in Reroute66.
Have I understood the question correctly and hopefully answered it correctly? I would be glad.
I didn't really follow the discussion on this variant earlier, but gave the page a fresh read. I think I mostly get it now, except how capturing on a switch works. It might be clarified in the comments, but it should be made plain in the page text as well. (Perhaps it is there too and I have missed it and/or it wasn't quite clear enough.)
Let's say I have a piece on 4, and the opponent has a piece that can otherwise move to a4 but not 4. Can they capture (and if so where do they end their move) or not (if not, could they potentially continue moving through a4 past my piece? I'm not sure that makes sense for any piece at the edge of the board like this, so probably moot, but I'll ask in case)?
Same question reversing 4 and a4. (Now the last question certainly can apply, e.g. the opponent piece is a rook on a8.)
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Interesting!
I'm reminded of the #Powerup-Zone tag, but this doesn't fit there. There's also Lumberjack which is sort of a simpler version of this, and of course Smess.
I've taken a stab at clarifying the 64+16 rule, please check that it is what was intended. I also cleaned up grammar in a few places (though it looks like someone else had a pass a the same today?).
Marsellais chess has a rule where each player moves 2 pieces in the same turn. Castling is considered a single move. All other castling rules apply.
I'm wondering what the number of moves played in an average game of Chinese Chess would be (for comparison, I've seen 40 or 42 moves given for FIDE Chess). Does anyone know?
What about 'Chess66'? Do you want to publish it - or possibly not and why not? If you don't want to continue with 'Chess66', then it won't work with 'Chess69' either. Anyway, then try the variant 'Avatar Chess' , which I think is programmable. Thanks in advance.
I wouldn't switch courier and knight. The charm is to respect the historical setup of Courier chess. That position for the knight, next to the rook is not unusual to my eyes.
Interesting! Creative! Insightful! I do have one small thought: would you consider transposing the courier and the knight? The knight would then be in its usual position, where expert players use it to contest the center and protect the king and queen. The bishop, a long-distance runner, would probably do just as well near the edge.
i think it does, and considering its been up for 20 years i think its doing good work.
Just noticed this comment. Apparently Old Shatar actually starts with the pawns on the 2nd and 7th ranks. 1. d4 d5 is mandatory first move. Since Old Shatar did not actually have the Hia, I wanted to keep the game as close as possible to the original but, of course, add a Hia. Your idea, of course, is good. I did add a game in a comment, as an example game. I think the checkmate is very nice.
I just noticed the question (only 6 years later). I think the stronger player will win. Here is a game with notes:
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d4 d5 mandatory first move
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g3 Nc6
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Bg2 e6
Pawns only move 1 space, except for the first required move (1. d4 d5) -
e3 b6
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f3 g6
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Kf2 / Hia e1 . . . White Hia goes to e1 (mandatory) 6.. . . . Bg7
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b3 Ba6
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Bb2 Nge7
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c3 Kd7 / Hia e8
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Nd2 Kc8
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Nh3 Kb7 As there is no castling in Shatar, Tony moves his King manually to reach something like a Queenside castle. He moves his King to b7 to free the Rook on a8 for his next move.
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a3 Rc8
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a4 Hia d7 Neither player is used to the Hia but they know it is a great defensive aide to the King. Tony moves his towards the Black monarch.
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b4 b5 Timmy wanted to pawn-fork the Bishop and Knight. Tony played b5 to stop it.
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axb Bxb5
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Qc2 Ra8
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Hia e2 . . . Black can’t capture the Hia with his Bishop as he’d have to stop at d3 due to the Hia’s protective field. . . . a6
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Ra2 Ra7
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R(h)a1 Hia d6
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e4 dxe
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Nxe4 . . . attacking the Hia . . .Hia d7
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Nc5+ Kb6
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Nxd7+ exchanging Knight for Hia . . . Qxd7
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Hia d3 . . . Annoying, the Black Bishop can’t take the Hia . . .Rha8
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Qb3 e5 Struggling for counterplay
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d5 Nxd5
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c4 Bxc4
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Qxc4 N(d)xb4
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Qb3 a5
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Hia c4 Bf8
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f4 Bc5 (This is not a check due to the Hia)
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Bxc6 Kxc6
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Ra4 Nd3+
Remember that Knights are immune from the Hia forces but Hias can still capture Knights. Here the Hia can’t capture the Knight because that would activate the Bishop’s check (from c5)). White playing 34. QxN would be a blunder because Black would play 34….QxQ and the Hia could not recapture due to the Bishop check factor. -
Kg2 Nxb2
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Qxb2 e4 (perhaps dreaming of a Queen)
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Ng5 Qe7
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Rb1 e3
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Qb5+ Kd5 (Kings are immune from Hias)
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Rd1 #
I'd suggest to move the link to your blog into this page, and delete the external link page.
You don't say here, but from playing one of the versions linked in your blog, it appears the same piece can be moved multiple times. That's worth saying explicitly, since that is one of the main things that differentiates some multi-move variants.
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Undertaker
The description of the Undertaker says it promotes to the Knightrider. I believe this is incorrect -- judging from the description of the Knightrider and the Dayrider, it should say the Undertaker promotes to the Dayrider.
Edited regarding letters: Berolina pawns changed from P to Q.
The Japanese Jostlers pawn is a regular Shatranj pawn (though with a different promotion). The image editor doesn't allow me to mix piece sets, unfortunately.
It appears the CVP website has been switched from http to https. Since the piece images are on my own website, which is http, the browser now refuses to display them.
In this case I can easily fix it, because the same piece set probably is somewhere on the CVP website, and if not, can be uploaded as user graphics. But the same problem will now manifest itself in other places. In particular, the 'Diagram Editor with Scalable Graphics' will be broken. This refers to a C program on my own website thar dynamically generates piece images according to specification, and now also is no longer accessible. So far Fergus did not manage to compile the same program for the CVP website, so that it could run there.
[Edit] Interesting. On my PC with FireFox all this works. Perhaps I have switched off this pedantic security feature there; I don't really remember.
The piece images are not showing up on the diagram for this game
I think this is unlikely. I have never seen the Edo-era description of Tenjiku Shogi, but I do know how such descriptions looked in general. They basically showed a drawing of the initial position, where each square contained a drawing of the way the piece moved, with the kanji of the piece name in the center. Sliding moves would just be radial lines, and it would be immediately clear whether the Lion Hawk also had orthogonal slides.
Only complex moves, such as the Lion, would not be obvious from the drawing, and would be described by an additional line of text. I once have seen the picture for the Teaching King (a piece from Maka Dai Dai Shogi); it had lines in 8 directions, each with 3 perpendicular line segments crossing it for indicating the multi-captures of teh Lion Dog. (And the text line then said it would move like Queen or Lion Dog.)
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'If there are only two Kings left on the board, the player with the King on the rank closest to the enemy camp wins.'
I added this rule